Beware of auto oil and additives

[Xlr8n]

Originally Posted by Plato

Does anyone really believe one will be "broken down" more than the other ?

Just for the sake of clarification, isn't that why they offer oils in different formulations and viscosities. Of course they will break down at different rates/degrees. Otherwise there would only be one type of oil for every vehicle. The point is, will either breakdown past the point of acceptable protection within the time between your oil changes? probably not, especially since they are both synthetic. Now dino oils definately display more marked degrees of decomposition due to type of formulation and weight. But, nearly all oils made today are so superior to what was offer 10-20 years ago, the differences between brands and types has become less drastic. Nearly all are designed to surpass engine manufacturers' requirements anyway, so even some of the cheapest are usually better than what is recommended. But I feel that you should definately choose a product that at least fufills all of the manufacturers requirements.

[Plato]

Originally Posted by Xlr8n

Just for the sake of clarification, isn't that why they offer oils in different formulations and viscosities. Of course they will break down at different rates/degrees. Otherwise there would only be one type of oil for every vehicle...

I think the original poster's point was that if it don't say motorcycle on the jug its not up to the task -beware the dangerous auto oil

Viscosity and operating environment does matter which is why I chose the example I did.

One type of oil for every vehicle... hmmmm I've got an old Ford Explorer (gas), an even older diesel pickup, and an 05 Nomad... About the only question I haven't settled on is whether to start running Rotella-T 5W-40 in the lawnmower

[Xlr8n]

I understand your point. I feel that synthetics are probably not negatively affected by the transmission components to the degree that petro based oils are. Is the Rotella T a true synthetic or one of the 'cracked' refined dinos?

[Plato]

Originally Posted by Xlr8n

I understand your point. I feel that synthetics are probably not negatively affected by the transmission components to the degree that petro based oils are. Is the Rotella T a true synthetic or one of the 'cracked' refined dinos?

I don't think its a full/true synthetic, at least I doubt it based on the low price. Frankly, in the Texas summers I may switch over to the brown cap Mobil-1 15W-50 -although I think the Rotella would be fine. It has a lot to do with what my local Walmart can keep stocked, lol.

[ridenagain]

It IS always great to read these oil thread debates. They are just so darn entertaining. In 30 years of running “engines”, I have never had a failure attributable to lubrication issues. From lawn mower to chipper/shredder to helicopter to auto to motorcycle. They are:

1. Check often, keep full.
2. Recommended weight.
3. Recommended interval.
4. Always change the filter too.

Everything else is just great conversation.

[oldodge]

If the "engine manufacturer" says to change oil at 7500 miles and the "oil manufacturer" says to change oil every 3000 miles does that mean that the "engine manufacturer" has more faith in the oil than the "oil manufacturer" does? Or is it that the oil guy is selling oil and the engine guy is selling engines? Does one wants you to buy less engines by buying more oil or does the other want you to buy more engines buy buying less oil? Do I seem confused? I say the '"engine manufacturers" reputation is on the line so his suggestion is probably conservative. But due to our paranoia we tend to believe the one selling the doom stories so we buy more oil. I'm guilty too, I don't for one minute think my bikes oil is shot at 3000 miles but I change it anyway. Imagine the shame I would bring on my family if I didn't? Nothing fancy for me, I use the same Castrol GTX I've used in bikes for 25 years. "Hello, my name is Tim, and I change my oil too often." Whew, I do feel better now!

[bluestringer]

Originally Posted by JK591

OK, here goes another can of worms (oil?). Motorcycle oil IS different than automobile oil in one major way. Most modern motorcycles use the same engine oil for their transmissions. (Older Triumph and BSA's had split cases or "pre-unit" engines.) Transmission gears are WAY harder on the oil than the combustion mechanics - i.e., piston, rings, etc. The meshing of the gears tend to "shear" the oil molecules and for that reason motorcycle oil has additives to inhibit that shearing process. Auto oil does not. Therefore, auto
oil breakdown happens really fast. True, you could save a few bucks a quart
by using it and changing your oil every five hundred miles, but that upsets those of us who may be ecologically minded. (Incidently, in Europe the average motorist goes around 8-10,000 miles between oil changes for reasons of economics and ecology and tend to view us as wasteful with our manufacturer's suggestion of 3-5000 here in the colonies.) For the longest time cycle oil also had to be formulated for air-cooled engines and still has ingredients for that, even though many/most bikes are liquid cooled. Also, beware of oil additives. Slick 150, STP, Marvel Oil etc. changes the chemical make-up of your oil - for the worse. If any of these additional additives were necessary, the various oil company chemists would already be doing it. (For just a few pennies.) Don't play junior chemist and undo their many years of
research in their million dollar laboratories. Incidentally, I really don't work for an OEM, and dislike paying the extra bucks for "special" oil and filters, but it makes a lot of sense to buy the best for my engine, and scrimp on my chrome
do-dads.

Pffffffttttt.

[CowboyBob]

Ridenagain summed it up best!!!! Especially since there is no hard proof one way or the other for syn/dino...If it is the recommended type, its changed regularly and the filter is changed you should have no problems!!! Usually an engine fails for something else, generally lack of maintenance, not bad oil! Lack of maintenance translates to lazy or uncaring owner! That person then becomes a hitchiker who will blame it on everything but themselves!!!!

[Phatboy]

Originally Posted by Xlr8n

Much of the info posted by JK591.....

If you'd click some links from that post you're quoting me on you'll see some articles showing testing that shows that motorcycle oils don't retain their viscosity better than auto. Don't believe the hype.

[Phatboy]

Originally Posted by ridenagain

1. Check often, keep full.
2. Recommended weight.
3. Recommended interval.
4. Always change the filter too.

Everything else is just great conversation.

Well said. I enjoy the converation =P

[sourdough]

I don't know of any motorcycle company that makes its own lubes. It usually goes to the lowest bidder! Think about it!

[esornivram]

Seafoam
,great in the fuel, i wont run in my the tranny/engine of bikes, maybe ok in car, but not a bike

[thrustmaster]

Originally Posted by Phatboy

I'm using oil for diesels which I suspect is even better than the moto oil =P
What?? Is your oil ch-4 rated?? =P

ps this one might be a thread killa 4 sure =P

What type diesel oil are you running? I was looking at putting rotella 15w-40 in mine but I've been running synthetic.

[yambike]

Energy conserving oil is poison to a motorcycle...plenty of zinc is beneficial so we use SG or SH premium oil with mucho zinc. BMW motor oils have lots of zinc and a good additive package...probably the best conventional oil for motorcycles and reportedly made by Spectro !
There is an old story about Spectro..seems that in 1948 when the first oldsmoblie V-8 came out there was a lot of camshaft failures. Spectro, a oil blender and packing outfit, dumped lots of zinc in their oil and the problem ended once and for all. Zinc...thats the good stuff in conventional oil.

[samuel]

I am using motorcycle oil in my auto since reading this thread, i dont have to change the oil in my car but every other time saves me a oil change and from the money saved I can buy a new bike every 20 years hehehe

[Sleepingthunder]

Does anybody think there are any bennefits of putting oil additives in your engine such as Slick 50 to prolong engine life & the like or is it all just hype

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Sleepingthunder

Does anybody think there are any bennefits of putting oil additives in your engine such as Slick 50 to prolong engine life & the like or is it all just hype

Hype...save your money and use a good, quality grade oil. Change it at the recommended intervals. You'll be pounds, dollars, yen ahead.

[RichLockyer]

Hype.

Dupont makes PTFE (Teflon) and filed a lawsuit against Slick 50 to try to stop them from putting it in their oil additive.
They lost the lawsuit... the courts basically ruled that Slick 50 could do anything they wanted to with a product that they bought from Dupont, and Dupont could not legally refuse to sell to them as long as they paid their bills.

Dupont countered with a public press release to the effect that Teflon was not designed to be used as an oil additive, that it can NOT "bond" to engine parts as described by Slick 50, and in fact in the form sold by Slick 50, it can clog oil passageways and the filter, forcing it into bypass.

[JimmyD]

Wow, someone was really mining here..

I think its funny to watch these debates. In this thread People have said the following:

1) Synthetics make your clutch slip
2) Energy conserving oils make your clutch slip
3) Automotive oils make your clutch slip
4) Automotive oils don't make your clutch slip enough and destroy your transmission due to the excessive friction in a motorcycle engine
5) Motorcycle oils have extra friction modifiers that dont break down from excessive driving. BUT somehow doesn't make your clutch slip excessively.

Now, I'm running 10w30 energy conserving automotive Dino oil in mine and I haven't had a single problem. When I changed it last (10w-30 for colder weather) the oil was still transparent, and I drove it for about 4000 miles.

If you want to buy into this crap about this and that additive then fine. That's what the oil companies want you to do.

Does anyone remember that brand of premium bottled water that was "oxygenated"? The premise was that there was extra oxygen in the water molecules or something. It was about 3 bucks for a 500mL bottle. Had all sorts of health claims about extra oxygen and this and that doing this and that.

But guess what? Unless you're choking on this water, its useless. Your lungs are the only place oxygen is used efficiently.

Anyway, I don't buy into all this crap. If anything, everyone in this forum should be using a 20w-50 Vtwin oil. Why? I have no idea. But apparently a normal motorcycle oil isn't enough for a V-twin. Otherwise there wouldn't be the need for a v-twin specific oil.

... or you can take all these claims with a grain of salt and make smart decisions. Either way, its your money.

[RichLockyer]

Originally Posted by JimmyD

Why? I have no idea. But apparently a normal motorcycle oil isn't enough for a V-twin. Otherwise there wouldn't be the need for a v-twin specific oil.

It's not that there's anything special about it being "V-Twin" oil... it's that it's a 20w50.

It's not THAT big of a deal with the Vulcans, because they are liquid cooled.
Traditional air-cooled V-twins tend to run hot in the rear cylinder, and require a heavier oil.

10w40 is actually fine for the Vulcan up to ambient temps in the 100's.