2nd slipping into neutral (kinda)

[joeschmo]

I have a 97 Vulcan 1500.

When I shift from 1st to 2nd, I can cruise fine for a few seconds and then I slip into neutral (but the neutral light doesn't come on). I shift up to 3rd and then back down to 2nd and I have no slipping.

I did allot of searching and saw several different possibilities:

Clutch spring (unlikely because its only on one gear)
2nd gear is worn (unlikely because it only happens shifting up)
Shifter fork (possibility)
Neutral selector switch (I'm leaning toward this)

What I need from you guys is some links to some "how to's" for checking and possibly replacing this stuff. Also if you have any other ideas of what it might be that would be cool.

Is there any way to adjust the Neutral selector?

I searched for this stuff the best I could because I don't want to ask the same questions that have been answered 1000 times. I just couldn't find any how to's (getting pretty tired too).

[Classic]

I don't recall the details but I'm pretty sure there was a FAR (Factory Authorized Repair) for the second gear problem on the 4 speed 1500 transmissions. You'll have to go to the dealer to find out and, this far down the road, it may no longer be in force by Kawasaki.

[joeschmo]

I dont really plan on taking the bike to a mechanic if I can help it, thats why I was asking for the how to's or any info on how to check those items

[Classic]

If you don't want to let the dealers mechanic have a look with the possiblility of getting it fixed for free then buy a Clymers manual and have at it.

[gbfromsd]

try a different oil, maybe a synthetic like Amsol.
Also, try wrapping the gear shift lever with 1/8 inch of electrical tape or something and see if that changes it. Maybe it's you.

[joeschmo]

Originally Posted by Classic

If you don't want to let the dealers mechanic have a look with the possiblility of getting it fixed for free then buy a Clymers manual and have at it.

Well I have mixed emotions about that. I really dont like to deal with mechanics that I dont know (no offense to any mechanics on here) I just dont trust them. But getting my vehicle fixed for free would be nice. I really didnt think that one of these FAR's would still be in effect 10 years after the vehicle was manufactured. I guess I should look into it. Is there any thing that you guys know of that could make the FAR void?

[joeschmo]

Originally Posted by gbfromsd

try a different oil, maybe a synthetic like Amsol.
Also, try wrapping the gear shift lever with 1/8 inch of electrical tape or something and see if that changes it. Maybe it's you.

I did switch to synthetic. I did think that maybe it was me so I tried pushing the shifter up as far as possible and even holding it there for a couple of seconds before releasing the clutch but it still did the same thing. It stayed in second for about 10 to 15 seconds and then it just pops out of gear. Do you think maybe its getting stuck betwen neutral and second?

[joeschmo]

Originally Posted by Classic

I don't recall the details but I'm pretty sure there was a FAR (Factory Authorized Repair) for the second gear problem on the 4 speed 1500 transmissions. You'll have to go to the dealer to find out and, this far down the road, it may no longer be in force by Kawasaki.

I found the FAR I think your talking abour but couldnt find an expiration date or time limit for it. Here's the FAR:

Kawasaki Motors Corporation
Models: Kawasaki VN1500 Year: 1997
Kawasaki Vulcan Year: 1997
Number Involved: 544
Dates of Manufacture: January - February 1997
NHTSA Recall No.: 97V233
Vehicle Description: Motorcycles.
Description of Defect: An improperly manufactured transmission gear can
cause weakening and eventual breakage of an adjacent gear.
Consequence of Defect: Gear breakage can result in transmission lockup,
causing the operator to lose control of the motorcycle.
Corrective Action: Dealers will inspect these motorcycles and repair
affected units.
Owner Notification: Owner notification began during late December 1997.
Note: Owners who take their vehicles to an authorized dealer on an agreed
upon service date and do not receive the free remedy within a reasonable
time should contact Kawasaki at 1-714-770-0400

[BikerBeagle]

Did the 97 1500 come with the heel-toe shifter? If so, is it remotely possible you are hitting the heel part accidentally?

The exact same thing happens to me about 1 out of every 40 times I shift and I've narrowed it down to 1 of 2 things ...either I'm accidentally hitting the heel shifter (I used to only notice it making left hand turns ...heh), or I'm not shifting 'hard enough' to put it completely in gear so that it is 'slipping out' into neutral.

[joeschmo]

no its only the toe shifter and this is happening every time, like i said before I've shifted up into 2nd as far as the lever would go, held it there for a few seconds, and then released the clutch and still the same thing happens. It goes into 2nd and stays there for about 5 to 10 seconds and then slips into limbo, the neutral light does not come on, to be honest its more like its in between 3rd and 2nd more than being in neutral

[rbentnail]

You may have encountered the same thing I did: started out slipping from 2 to N when upshifting. Problem expanded to jumping from 2 to N when downshifting, then expanded to not being able to find 2nd gear at all. I had 2 worn shift forks and 2 damaged gear & dog assys. If this is the case for you, and I hope it's not, the engine will have to be taken out of the bike and split open to inspect the tranny. A bike shop or stealership will charge about $2000 to fix this for you. And once the engine casings are separated, you will constantly be fixing oil and coolant leaks b/c nothing seals off correctly once opened. Good Luck!!!

My advice is to pawn the POS bike you have off onto someone else. If I had more cash on hand it's exactly what I would have done already...

[slicktech]

Nothing seals correctly once cracked open? Who worked on your bike? That is simply not true.

Nothing says fun like transmission work. Could be a shift fork, I would lean towards worn dogs and/or interfacing gear. This is a good job for someone with experience.

[joeschmo]

Originally Posted by rbentnail

You may have encountered the same thing I did: started out slipping from 2 to N when upshifting. Problem expanded to jumping from 2 to N when downshifting, then expanded to not being able to find 2nd gear at all. I had 2 worn shift forks and 2 damaged gear & dog assys. If this is the case for you, and I hope it's not, the engine will have to be taken out of the bike and split open to inspect the tranny. A bike shop or stealership will charge about $2000 to fix this for you. And once the engine casings are separated, you will constantly be fixing oil and coolant leaks b/c nothing seals off correctly once opened. Good Luck!!!

My advice is to pawn the POS bike you have off onto someone else. If I had more cash on hand it's exactly what I would have done already...

From the research I've done I think this is exactly what the problem is. I'm hoping its not but the symptoms are there. Is there any way to check this with out cracking open the engine? I'm guessing no, but I figure maybe one of you guru's might have a trick up your sleeve.

[bluestringer]

I agree with Classic. There is a FAR on the problem, you could call and check if it's still good. If not, or you don't want to fool with a dealer mechanic, just buy a service manual and get to work. Ebay has lots of Clymer manuals for the 1500, and repairmanual.com has Kawasaki service manuals.

[rbentnail]

Originally Posted by slicktech

Nothing seals correctly once cracked open? Who worked on your bike? That is simply not true.

Nothing says fun like transmission work. Could be a shift fork, I would lean towards worn dogs and/or interfacing gear. This is a good job for someone with experience.

I'm afraid it is true. "We" are now working on the 3rd oil leak and the 2nd coolant leak since the original work last fall. Tech would like to crack the case yet again to regasket, etc.

The dude working on it now, the previous 2 have since been fired, is about 60 yrs old and been working on bikes for about 40 of them.

[rbentnail]

Originally Posted by joeschmo

From the research I've done I think this is exactly what the problem is. I'm hoping its not but the symptoms are there. Is there any way to check this with out cracking open the engine? I'm guessing no, but I figure maybe one of you guru's might have a trick up your sleeve.

From my experience, no there's no way to know without cracking the case. But more info: we all know the v-twins make weird noises. About the same the shifting problems started, I got a new sound, but only in 5th gear: it sounded like a paper clip in the beater brush of a vacuum cleaner. Went away in 4th, came back in 5th. Don't know if it was related. When downshifting from 3rd to 2nd, the only way to keep it from jumping to N was apply some throttle and rear brake together while downshifting. That worked most of the time, until I lost 2nd completely. Then every time I tried to go to 2nd from 3rd, it sounds like a quiet rapid bam, bam, bam like a small jackhammer. When shifting from 1st to 2nd it would just jump into N every time.

[joeschmo]

well you are kinda confirming my worst fears. this blows

[vulcan90063445]

Originally Posted by joeschmo

I have a 97 Vulcan 1500.

When I shift from 1st to 2nd, I can cruise fine for a few seconds and then I slip into neutral (but the neutral light doesn't come on). I shift up to 3rd and then back down to 2nd and I have no slipping.

I did allot of searching and saw several different possibilities:

Clutch spring (unlikely because its only on one gear)
2nd gear is worn (unlikely because it only happens shifting up)
Shifter fork (possibility)
Neutral selector switch (I'm leaning toward this)

What I need from you guys is some links to some "how to's" for checking and possibly replacing this stuff. Also if you have any other ideas of what it might be that would be cool.

Is there any way to adjust the Neutral selector?

I searched for this stuff the best I could because I don't want to ask the same questions that have been answered 1000 times. I just couldn't find any how to's (getting pretty tired too).

Take it back to your dealer before u make it worse...

[vulcan90063445]

Ok sounds like you have a real problem...if it as bad as it sounds..Removing the engine I hope you are a good mech. and can fix it yourself. If not. Do you have the bike paid for or close to it?? If so what I would do is trade it for a new bike and don't say a word about the problem. Of course if this problem is a common as it sounds the dealer may know what to look for. Next choice sell it outright. It does sound like your doing the proper research. Could be you could fix it yourself and do a good job and not have any leaks afterwords. Wish I were closer to you I would be glad to help and I think my dealer would help as much as he could because he is a very good guy. An ex racer who Bleeds Kawi Green. Tell you what. This is his busness number I am sure if he knows about this problem he can give you some advice. 319-524-2771 His name is Bob don't be pushy and remember HE can tell u to F.O. at any time.

[joeschmo]

Originally Posted by vulcan90063445

OK sounds like you have a real problem...if it as bad as it sounds..Removing the engine I hope you are a good mech. and can fix it yourself. If not. Do you have the bike paid for or close to it?? If so what I would do is trade it for a new bike and don't say a word about the problem. Of course if this problem is a common as it sounds the dealer may know what to look for. Next choice sell it outright. It does sound like your doing the proper research. Could be you could fix it yourself and do a good job and not have any leaks afterwords. Wish I were closer to you I would be glad to help and I think my dealer would help as much as he could because he is a very good guy. An ex racer who Bleeds Kawi Green. Tell you what. This is his busness number I am sure if he knows about this problem he can give you some advice. 319-524-2771 His name is Bob don't be pushy and remember HE can tell u to F.O. at any time.

Thanks for the input. I will definitely give him a call. The bike is paid for but getting a new bike is financially impossible right now, hell even paying to have it fixed is not possible. I am mechanically inclined but have not done much on bikes and nothing this extensive but with all that being said I would rather try and fix it myself and screw it up beyond belief than part with the bike. That might be stupid but I just like the bike too much to get rid of it. So it looks like I'm going to be buying a service manual and getting real familiar with the engine.

Originally Posted by vulcan90063445

His name is Bob don't be pushy and remember HE can tell u to F.O. at any time.

So do i come off as pushy?