Lowsided at the track

[clausiam]

Originally Posted by CheeseHeadNinja

Really caught me off guard.. I didn't feel like I entered the turn any faster than normal, nor do I remember gassing it out any harder than usual. It was totally a surprise when I lost the back end. Not sure what happened. I wouldn't be as upset if I knew what I did so I could learn from it. I'm assuming the only thing that it could have been was A) Gassed it too hard while coming out B) Tires not warmed up enough C) Hit something on the track (probably not this but who knows).

or
D) You repositioned your body while leaned over, upset the suspension and the rear lost traction?

The one time I came close to crashing at the track was because I decided to hang off some more while I was in mid-turn. Moving my body weight unloaded the suspension just enough to cause the rear tire to slide and then hook up again. If you need to turn sharper in mid-turn I believe the correct way is to drop your inside shoulder a bit (I think Tweek described this as a hook-turn from his CSS school sessions).

Anyway, glad to hear you're ok, it could be a number of reasons, maybe you just hit a different area of the turn that had less traction.

[stefano]

Dude, sorry to hear about your spill. It's great that you came out of it OK, but that REALLY sucks about your bike man

As for why you fell, I wouldn't get all worked up about trying to figure out why. If you haven't already, it means it was nothing big or noticeable. Having said that, we all know how precarious traction is on 2 wheels, as you've already said, it could be anything from a spot of oil/liquid on the track to a change in track temperature... maybe as clausiam said you changed your line by 6 inches and found a stretch of track which wasn't as rubbered in as on the racing line...

I wouldn't worry about that... I would worry about what to do to get that bike fixed and get back on the saddle ASAP!!!

[CheeseHeadNinja]

Originally Posted by sebastian1000

No not the 10R cheese! Glad you are OK. It hurts me to see your bike in that condition bro! So track only huh? Cool. I would just pick up some SharkSkins for it...can be had relatively cheap and are a little lighter weight. Also, maybe check out the cycle boneyards for the clip-ons and other misc. stuff... What brand frame sliders were those?
-S

I still have the Z1000 for the street

I've already begun looking for clipons/footpegs on ebay. Looks like I'll be able to get the bike operational for under $150. I'm considering getting race plastics... we'll see.

[CheeseHeadNinja]

Originally Posted by clausiam

or
D) You repositioned your body while leaned over, upset the suspension and the rear lost traction?

The one time I came close to crashing at the track was because I decided to hang off some more while I was in mid-turn. Moving my body weight unloaded the suspension just enough to cause the rear tire to slide and then hook up again. If you need to turn sharper in mid-turn I believe the correct way is to drop your inside shoulder a bit (I think Tweek described this as a hook-turn from his CSS school sessions).

Anyway, glad to hear you're ok, it could be a number of reasons, maybe you just hit a different area of the turn that had less traction.

Yes this is very possible. But the thing that gets me is I don't remember doing anything out of the ordinary on that turn. Usually I'd only change body position (pull shoulder down more) if I was going to run wide, and I don't remember going in faster or on a wider line.

One thing I was wondering... I was running the same Pilot Power 2CT from my last trackday. Do tires, after going thru ~15 heat cycles, start taking longer to heat up? I know most people generally only run tires for one trackday, is it because of the tires losing effectiveness from many heat cycles? I ask because I noticed throughout the day that the tires weren't so "blistered" and rough with rubber chunks peeling off as they were the first day on the tires. They were more smooth like you'd see from street riding.

In any case, I'll be running track tires not street tires next year

[clausiam]

Originally Posted by CheeseHeadNinja

One thing I was wondering... I was running the same Pilot Power 2CT from my last trackday. Do tires, after going thru ~15 heat cycles, start taking longer to heat up?

I'm no expert but I don't think that's the case. Any DOT-legal tires can take a lot of heat cycles without deteriorating significantly. That's why occasional track day riders don't need to spend money on tire warmers. The tires will be worn before the heat cycles become an issue. And they also have a wide temperature/grip band so in most cases cold tire crashing is not an issue for DOT-rubber. If you go to race-only tires you get more maximum grip but the trade-in is having to use tire warmers to get them into the narrow temperature where they have that grip and to keep them there when you're off the track because they only have a few heat cycles in them.

Originally Posted by CheeseHeadNinja

I know most people generally only run tires for one trackday, is it because of the tires losing effectiveness from many heat cycles?

Not sure what you mean by "most people" but I'm pretty sure most track-day riders that are not racers get more than one track day out of a set of tires (assuming a typical day with 6-7 20 minute sessions). I got 3 days out of my last set and there may have been enough left for a 4th day when I decided to switch them (this is on a 636 - the 10R shreds the rubber a bit quicker).

[daemon]

Originally Posted by CheeseHeadNinja

I still have the Z1000 for the street

that in itself is one step above some of us!!!

i still would like to keep mine pristine,but i'm addicted to the track as well

[ervins]

Sorry to hear that...Time for a new bike!

[Tweek]

Sorry to hear about your off bike adventure. Falling down sucks.

Your bike doesnt look too bad. Time to search E-bay.

[fitbmxseries1]

it looks like the race plastics are cheaper then the original. I say turn it into a track bike.
Good to hear that your ok, Looks like your leathers held up pretty good! How sore are you feeling?

[CheeseHeadNinja]

Not really sore at all. If my gloves hadn't ripped, I'd be perfectly unharmed.

[jtcNinja]

good to hear you are ok... I hopefully wont experience a crash any time soon... I've had my fair amount of crashes when I raced motocross so I dont want to even imagine sliding on pavement.. though many of the times I would have prefered that than smacking my helmet off the handlebars and then slamming down on dirt. I'm in the works to find me a track just for a day to see how it is.. probably will get addicted to it but I'd like to get some pro lessons on riding, would certainly be cool.

[CrazyCracka]

Id definately say invest in some race dot tires!! Pirelli being my personal pref, but it is just that...my preference. If you do go with some dot tire you dont need to worry about tire warmers thou they are a great tool, not necessary. Just take it easy the first couple laps, being extra smooth on the throttle, specially on the 1k and leaning in nice and smooth and somewhat slow the tires will heat up just fine. Being as I only ride a 600 Ive gotten about 3 track days at MOST outta tires, but that third day I was spinning the back wheel outta just about every turn at laguna so from now on 2 days only. Anyways, just some info for you to throw around in your head! hurry and rebuild that beast!!

[CheeseHeadNinja]

Originally Posted by CrazyCracka

Id definately say invest in some race dot tires!! Pirelli being my personal pref, but it is just that...my preference. If you do go with some dot tire you don't need to worry about tire warmers thou they are a great tool, not necessary. Just take it easy the first couple laps, being extra smooth on the throttle, specially on the 1k and leaning in nice and smooth and somewhat slow the tires will heat up just fine. Being as I only ride a 600 Ive gotten about 3 track days at MOST outta tires, but that third day I was spinning the back wheel outta just about every turn at laguna so from now on 2 days only. Anyways, just some info for you to throw around in your head! hurry and rebuild that beast!!

Geez.. spinning the tires on a 600 at every corner? And you didn't crash? Well obviously I can't control rear wheel spin, and with a zx10r.. Maybe it's best I use em 2 days and then stay in 1 gear higher to reduce the risk...

[CrazyCracka]

Geez.. spinning the tires on a 600 at every corner? And you didn't crash?

lol no not every corner but the tighter ones there was definately some sliding n spinning, and I had a couple close offs for sure.

[gr8ride]

Get a $5.00 can of spray paint and give it a decent paint job. No need to buy new plastics if you are going to make it a track bike. You could use a putty to fill in the scratches and sand them down if you have the time. I don't think it would make much sense to buy new plastics for a bike you could make track only with a little elbow grease. Especially when you are going through tires $$$$$

[CheeseHeadNinja]

Originally Posted by gr8ride

Get a $5.00 can of spray paint and give it a decent paint job. No need to buy new plastics if you are going to make it a track bike. You could use a putty to fill in the scratches and sand them down if you have the time. I don't think it would make much sense to buy new plastics for a bike you could make track only with a little elbow grease. Especially when you are going through tires $$$$$

I'm not even gonna fill the scratches or paint it. I'll leave it scratched for now. If over the winter I feel particularly ambitious, I might ditch the lights/signals and get race plastics.

[bennice]

Oh dang! Sorry to hear about the mishap...the bike doesn't look good at all. It's heartbreaking to see such a fine ride all jacked up, but at least you're still here to talk about it, and your gear saved you from getting tore up too bad.