Anyone ever read "The Art Of War"?

*trikebubble* · 12-08-2005

I was just going over a stack of books beside our bed. Ones that i have read, need to finish, or re-read again.

I have read The Art Of War, need to go over it again when time permits. But was wondering if anyone has read it, and what practical advice did you take from it.
Just curious.

I still need to finish the latest Jimmy buffett novel, as well as the novel Intensity, which has been collecting a lot of dust as of late.

bross · 12-08-2005

Nope sorry. Currently reading "Long Way Round", after that I think I'll read "Two Wheels Through Terror". The second one is all about last years Red Lodge reunion!

BigJohn · 12-08-2005

Read the majority of it while preparing for NCO Leadership School. The practical side for me was/is on the art of discipline and planning. However, the discussions on the morality of war were interesting.

"16. The consummate leader cultivates the moral law,
and strictly adheres to method and discipline; thus it is
in his power to control success."

*ispeed77* · 12-08-2005

nope, sorry. saw a movie named that and it wasn't great, how was the book ?

**2WheelFun** · 12-08-2005

I can't read.

*trikebubble* · 12-09-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by ispeed77

nope, sorry. saw a movie named that and it wasn't great, how was the book ?

The movie has nothing in common, or anything to do with the book.

Mr_Lycos · 12-09-2005

Ghost Dog:Way of the Samurai had more to do with The Art of War than The Art of War. And he didn't even read the same book.

*ispeed77* · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by trikebubble

The movie has nothing in common, or anything to do with the book.

i kinda figured that

**Spok** · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Lycos

Ghost Dog:Way of the Samurai had more to do with The Art of War than The Art of War. And he didn't even read the same book.

I actually watched that movie from about the 1/3 point to the end, it was a very unique story line.

I'd like to see it again.

*ispeed77* · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Lycos

Ghost Dog:Way of the Samurai had more to do with The Art of War than The Art of War. And he didn't even read the same book.

can't say i've heard of that one

**Spok** · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by ispeed77

can't say i've heard of that one

its a story of a mafia hit man who was taught the samurai way and applies it to his lifes work...its a good movie, i'd like to see it again.

*ispeed77* · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by spok

its a story of a mafia hit man who was taught the samurai way and applies it to his lifes work...its a good movie, i'd like to see it again.

sounds cool, i should look it up

ejshotgun · 12-11-2005

"appear where you are not expected."

RampRat · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by trikebubble

I have read The Art Of War, need to go over it again when time permits. But was wondering if anyone has read it, and what practical advice did you take from it.

6 or 7 times I think & the last time was early 2001 when in the UAE. It was always one of those books I took with me & read a portion of before hitting the rack.

To sum up The Art of War in a nutshell you must Understand the enemy and know yourself

Carl Von Clausewitz book On War is another excellent book, but it's a hard one to read.

RampRat · 12-11-2005

Here is my personal Leadership 101 quotes and quick reference items you can attribute in one way or another to The Art of War

Management dictates. Leaders guide and assist.

You manage THINGS

You lead PEOPLE

Now and again there are those chosen few who have to knowingly enter a situation where there is a strong chance that they will not make it home to their loved ones. These men suck it up, drive on and save the lives of others with the sacrifice of theirs. These men are heroes and they are a rare and noble breed.

Management sits around a table in a conference room deciding what to dictate.

Leaders are in the field at the head of their pack making sure assigned personnel are getting the job done right the first time.

Management signs paychecks.

Leaders are those people who are looked up to for guidance, tough situation assistance and who can be counted on to give you hell when you screw up - coupled with what you need to know so that you don't screw up again.

Management sees you as an entity, a resource. Leaders see you as people, valuable to the execution of the assigned tasks.

A leader lets you know in a truly heartfelt way when you've done a good job and your efforts are appreciated.

A manager only says it superficially...

A leader knows the job inside and out and can perform as an example. A leader grows and nurtures their replacement starting immediately. A leader makes the hard calls even when it is not popular. A leader demands loyalty from his team and gives it at the same time. A leader does not ask/demand that his people do anything he won't get right in there and do with them. Above all, a leader can look at themselves in the mirror every day and have respect for whom they see.

You will find a Leader out in the field doing the job alongside his/her troops, while the Manager is back at the office.

A true leader doesn't eat until his troops are fed

It's an odd dichotomy that a company officer is both DI and nursemaid, but it's how it works out. The more trust the officer has in his men, the more that trust will be rewarded. Of course, they crew needs to be able to do their job first... both from a basic skills and a managerial micromanagement standpoint.
Supervision is easy because it just requires enforcement of existing standards. Leadership requires motivating people to want to make the standard, and developing new standards for new situations. This means the leader has to put his neck/job/reputation on the line - where the supervisor can point to the existing standard to cover his ***.

Supervisors are the ones that sit back in the station and tell you what you did wrong, what policies were violated, and what you could have done better. Afterwards they get together with other supervisors and talk about how they would have done better if they were there.

Leaders are in the field with you helping to set up perimeters and put together entry/arrests teams which they are on. Afterwards they get together with the officers on their team, have a beer, and talk about what the officers did well and what could have gone better.

In the end the supervisor is there to make himself look good, the leader is there to develop his people and help them look good.

1400pilot · 12-11-2005

doesn't it all come down to

Kill'em all and let God sort em out!!!!!!!

*trikebubble* · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1600pilot

doesn't it all come down to

Kill'em all and let God sort em out!!!!!!!

not necassarily.

1400pilot · 12-11-2005

here are some more sayings that i found about war
When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend.

You don't win a war by dying for your country. You win a war by making the other son-of-a-***** die for his. - General Patton

If it's stupid but works, it isn't stupid.

Cluster bombing from B-52s is very, very accurate - - the bombs always hit the ground.

If the enemy is in range, so are you.

The difficult we do immediately. The impossible takes a little while longer. - U.S. Navy Seabees

It is generally inadvisable to eject directly over the area you just bombed.

Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons!

When in doubt empty the magazine.

If God had meant for us to be in the Army, we would have been born with green, baggy skin.

Try to look unimportant, they may be low on ammo.

"You, you, and you: Panic. The rest of you, come with me."

Odd objects attract fire - never lurk behind one.

Incoming fire has the right of way.

Don't look conspicuous: it draws fire.

Tracers work both ways.

Five second fuses only last three seconds.

A slipping gear could let your M203 grenade launcher fire when you least expect it. That would make you quite unpopular in what's left of your unit. — from the Army's magazine of preventive maintenance.

Who *cares* if a laser guided 500 lb bomb is accurate to within 9 feet?

The easy way is always mined.

Don't ever be the first, don't ever be the last and don't ever volunteer to do anything.

Never share a fox hole with anyone braver than you.

Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid.

If your attack is going well, you have walked into an ambush.

Never trust a private with a loaded weapon, or an officer with a map.

If you can't remember, the Claymore is pointed towards you.

Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy someone else to shoot at.

Push to test... Release to detonate.

Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't.

There is no such thing as an atheist in a foxhole.

No combat ready unit has ever passed inspection.

Make it too tough for the enemy to get in and you can't get out.

Any ship can be a minesweeper... once.

Never tell the Platoon Sergeant you have nothing to do.

The more you sweat in peace, the less you bleed in war.

Don't draw fire, it irritates the people around you.

The enemy invariably attacks on one of two occasions: 1. When you're ready for them. 2. When you're not ready for them.

Combat will occur on the ground between two adjoining maps.

Friendly fire - isn't.

Sometimes I think war is God's way of teaching us geography. - Paul Rodriguez

The side with the simplest uniforms wins.

When you're short of everything but the enemy, you're in combat.

Mines are equal opportunity weapons.

We are not retreating, we are advancing in another direction.

If you find yourself in a fair fight you didn't plan your mission properly!

Instruction printed on US Rocket Launcher - "Aim towards Enemy"

CowboyBob · 12-11-2005

I haven't read that book though it sounds like one I would like. My most recent read is "Under and Alone", the true story of an ATF agent who infiltrates the Mongols MC in So. Cal. Excellent book BTW!

1400pilot · 12-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by trikebubble

not necassarily.

yup your right.........I went and looked at the book on the internet, looks like a very deep read, and to have been written by the chinese over 100 years ago.

I can see where a person could apply some of the teachings to everyday life.

12-08-2005	#1 (permalink)
trikebubble Slow Guy on a Fast Bike Extreme Forum Supporter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Okanagan Falls, BC Posts: 22,636	Anyone ever read "The Art Of War"? I was just going over a stack of books beside our bed. Ones that i have read, need to finish, or re-read again. I have read The Art Of War, need to go over it again when time permits. But was wondering if anyone has read it, and what practical advice did you take from it. Just curious. I still need to finish the latest Jimmy buffett novel, as well as the novel Intensity, which has been collecting a lot of dust as of late. __________________ 08 Midnite Sapphire Blue ZX-14

12-08-2005	#3 (permalink)
BigJohn Power Hungry V2K Rider Forum Supporter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Lake Stevens, WA Posts: 6,393	Read the majority of it while preparing for NCO Leadership School. The practical side for me was/is on the art of discipline and planning. However, the discussions on the morality of war were interesting. "16. The consummate leader cultivates the moral law, and strictly adheres to method and discipline; thus it is in his power to control success." __________________ '00 Nomad '06 V2K LT Because RED is the fastest color... Last edited by BigJohn : 12-08-2005 at 05:19 PM.

12-08-2005	#4 (permalink)
ispeed77 RIP Deron Harden :-( Extreme Forum Supporter Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Gardner, MA Posts: 32,533	nope, sorry. saw a movie named that and it wasn't great, how was the book ? __________________ David - Moderator 2002 Suzuki DRZ400 2003 1500 Meanie, scraping pipes and frame :-) In loving memory of Deron Harden, forever in our thoughts :-(

12-08-2005	#5 (permalink)
2WheelFun the "fun" guy Extreme Forum Supporter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Albion, Washington "Pacific Northwest" Posts: 32,679	I can't read. __________________ *KING KAHUNA* *2007 V2K LT* ****PICS** 2007 Brute Force 650i **PICS** I love the smell of SeaFoam in the morning**

12-09-2005	#7 (permalink)
Mr_Lycos Wants better weather! BTK Expert Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Carthage, NY Posts: 950	Ghost Dog:Way of the Samurai had more to do with The Art of War than The Art of War. And he didn't even read the same book. __________________ Was run-over by a car 7/16. Am now riding a computer chair.

12-11-2005	#13 (permalink)
ejshotgun How 'bout a Poke? BTK Expert Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Fort Smith, AR Posts: 492	"appear where you are not expected." __________________ '77 KZ1000 LTD

12-11-2005	#15 (permalink)
RampRat Needs A Real Job BTK Expert Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Wyoming Posts: 3,846	Here is my personal Leadership 101 quotes and quick reference items you can attribute in one way or another to The Art of War Management dictates. Leaders guide and assist. You manage THINGS You lead PEOPLE Now and again there are those chosen few who have to knowingly enter a situation where there is a strong chance that they will not make it home to their loved ones. These men suck it up, drive on and save the lives of others with the sacrifice of theirs. These men are heroes and they are a rare and noble breed. Management sits around a table in a conference room deciding what to dictate. Leaders are in the field at the head of their pack making sure assigned personnel are getting the job done right the first time. Management signs paychecks. Leaders are those people who are looked up to for guidance, tough situation assistance and who can be counted on to give you hell when you screw up - coupled with what you need to know so that you don't screw up again. Management sees you as an entity, a resource. Leaders see you as people, valuable to the execution of the assigned tasks. A leader lets you know in a truly heartfelt way when you've done a good job and your efforts are appreciated. A manager only says it superficially... A leader knows the job inside and out and can perform as an example. A leader grows and nurtures their replacement starting immediately. A leader makes the hard calls even when it is not popular. A leader demands loyalty from his team and gives it at the same time. A leader does not ask/demand that his people do anything he won't get right in there and do with them. Above all, a leader can look at themselves in the mirror every day and have respect for whom they see. You will find a Leader out in the field doing the job alongside his/her troops, while the Manager is back at the office. A true leader doesn't eat until his troops are fed It's an odd dichotomy that a company officer is both DI and nursemaid, but it's how it works out. The more trust the officer has in his men, the more that trust will be rewarded. Of course, they crew needs to be able to do their job first... both from a basic skills and a managerial micromanagement standpoint. Supervision is easy because it just requires enforcement of existing standards. Leadership requires motivating people to want to make the standard, and developing new standards for new situations. This means the leader has to put his neck/job/reputation on the line - where the supervisor can point to the existing standard to cover his ***. Supervisors are the ones that sit back in the station and tell you what you did wrong, what policies were violated, and what you could have done better. Afterwards they get together with other supervisors and talk about how they would have done better if they were there. Leaders are in the field with you helping to set up perimeters and put together entry/arrests teams which they are on. Afterwards they get together with the officers on their team, have a beer, and talk about what the officers did well and what could have gone better. In the end the supervisor is there to make himself look good, the leader is there to develop his people and help them look good. __________________ "It's not a gun-free zone if you get shot while you're there"

12-11-2005	#16 (permalink)
1400pilot UBER CLUB MEMBER #2 Forum Supporter Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Holdrege, Nebraska Posts: 13,839	doesn't it all come down to Kill'em all and let God sort em out!!!!!!! __________________ Click for a map of the states I've ridden in 08 ZG1400 Concours 06 KDX200 04KX65

12-11-2005	#18 (permalink)
1400pilot UBER CLUB MEMBER #2 Forum Supporter Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Holdrege, Nebraska Posts: 13,839	here are some more sayings that i found about war When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend. You don't win a war by dying for your country. You win a war by making the other son-of-a-***** die for his. - General Patton If it's stupid but works, it isn't stupid. Cluster bombing from B-52s is very, very accurate - - the bombs always hit the ground. If the enemy is in range, so are you. The difficult we do immediately. The impossible takes a little while longer. - U.S. Navy Seabees It is generally inadvisable to eject directly over the area you just bombed. Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered automatic weapons! When in doubt empty the magazine. If God had meant for us to be in the Army, we would have been born with green, baggy skin. Try to look unimportant, they may be low on ammo. "You, you, and you: Panic. The rest of you, come with me." Odd objects attract fire - never lurk behind one. Incoming fire has the right of way. Don't look conspicuous: it draws fire. Tracers work both ways. Five second fuses only last three seconds. A slipping gear could let your M203 grenade launcher fire when you least expect it. That would make you quite unpopular in what's left of your unit. — from the Army's magazine of preventive maintenance. Who cares if a laser guided 500 lb bomb is accurate to within 9 feet? The easy way is always mined. Don't ever be the first, don't ever be the last and don't ever volunteer to do anything. Never share a fox hole with anyone braver than you. Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid. If your attack is going well, you have walked into an ambush. Never trust a private with a loaded weapon, or an officer with a map. If you can't remember, the Claymore is pointed towards you. Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy someone else to shoot at. Push to test... Release to detonate. Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't. There is no such thing as an atheist in a foxhole. No combat ready unit has ever passed inspection. Make it too tough for the enemy to get in and you can't get out. Any ship can be a minesweeper... once. Never tell the Platoon Sergeant you have nothing to do. The more you sweat in peace, the less you bleed in war. Don't draw fire, it irritates the people around you. The enemy invariably attacks on one of two occasions: 1. When you're ready for them. 2. When you're not ready for them. Combat will occur on the ground between two adjoining maps. Friendly fire - isn't. Sometimes I think war is God's way of teaching us geography. - Paul Rodriguez The side with the simplest uniforms wins. When you're short of everything but the enemy, you're in combat. Mines are equal opportunity weapons. We are not retreating, we are advancing in another direction. If you find yourself in a fair fight you didn't plan your mission properly! Instruction printed on US Rocket Launcher - "Aim towards Enemy" __________________ Click for a map of the states I've ridden in 08 ZG1400 Concours 06 KDX200 04KX65

12-11-2005	#19 (permalink)
CowboyBob Banned BTK Expert Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,839	I haven't read that book though it sounds like one I would like. My most recent read is "Under and Alone", the true story of an ATF agent who infiltrates the Mongols MC in So. Cal. Excellent book BTW!

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