Super moto power with kz550 engine (project)

[Lawn Masters]

with the exhaust mounted in place it appears you're going to have problems turning. I may be wrong, but thats how it looks.

[nelson8708]

Originally Posted by eslmatt

Try not using the kleenex under the tape. The glue on the tape helps seal the wound. Let it air out as soon as it stops bleeding. Helps with the healing.

Looks cool, do you have enough room for front wheel travel? looks like it will get close on full compression.

It was a bandaid under the tape....Good info to help it heal faster though, thanks. With a stock exhaust i would most likely have problems with clearance during compression of the forks but, i plan on making a custom exhaust anyway. Probably going to 90 out the head and go on the outside of the down tubes then 90 down and run them back until their under the foot pegs. Either a slice cut exit or a 45 down a the end. These old engines sounds awsome with straight pipes. This is a kz650 but, i hope my sounds similar....

YouTube - "Small Arms Customs" 1978 Kawasaki KZ650 Bobber

[nelson8708]

^gutted for some paint

^some of the bracing i added

^trimmed the gas tank to clear the carbs.

So now has come the point where i have a few questions. First is i plan on gutting the stock air box and putting the battery in there along with the rectifier and igniter. I was wondering if the igniter and rectifier need to have air flow over them or if they are inside the battery box (gutted yz airbox) will they be ok? Also, now that i have trimmed the gas tank to clear the carbs i need to figure a way to seal up the huge hole in the bottom of the tank. I went and bought a plastic welder from harbor freight and i dont know if its the welder or just maybe i cant weld plastic but, it didn't work very well. Is there anywhere i can send the tank to get it finished?

[Lawn Masters]

lets see exactly what you trimmed and where, that may give me ideas on how to fix it.

This thing is coming together FAST, for one of those projects of insanity like this anyhow.

[nelson8708]

Originally Posted by Lawn Masters

lets see exactly what you trimmed and where, that may give me ideas on how to fix it.

This thing is coming together FAST, for one of those projects of insanity like this anyhow.

Thanks.....i need to get it finished before i think about what i'm doing . Next will be mounting the coils and making the battery box. If i cant find anywhere/anybody who can plastic weld then i'm thinking of making the bottom out of sheet metal and then using self tapping screws and JB weld or some kinda of epoxy to seal up. It would look like crap but, i have to use the stock tank since part of the seat locks onto the tank.

[nelson8708]

Well i'm now wiring the bike and have a few questions. Just to make sure i have everything correct before i put power to it i would like a for a few others to check to make sure i have the correct wires going to ground and power.



Ignitor :
D/G - coil ground
B - coil ground
R/Y - 12v source
Y/B - Ground

Rectifier :
R/W - 12v source ( back to the B+ termial since i think this is the charging wire)
B - Ground
Br - 12v source

Correct or not?

I'm also running vulcan coils and am trying to figure out which terminal on the coil gets power and which gets ground. One terminal is green and the other is black....anyone know?

Getting closer and closer to seeing if the engine runs

[RichLockyer]

On the 1600, the wiring harness red/green stripe goes to +12v (both coils), and the other terminal the wires are black for one coil and black/green for the other coil. Honestly, I'm not sure that it even makes a difference.... the coil fires when the magnetic field expands and collapses, and that's going to happen no matter which way they are wired.

[nelson8708]

Its not the wiring colors i need its the pins on the coil its self that are black and the other green. I know on car coils if you mix up the wires it will blow them.....at least honda coils. I might have to make a trip up to a dealer and have them look at them or post a question in the cruiser section.

[RichLockyer]

Just looked at the right coil on my 1600 (can't get to the left without pulling the bike out of the garage, 1500 and 1600 are nearly identical) and the green terminal is the lead to the ignitor, the black terminal is +12v.

[Mike900]

Why'd you choose Vulcan coils?
Am I correct that you'll need four of them?

[RichLockyer]

Originally Posted by Mike900

Why'd you choose Vulcan coils?
Am I correct that you'll need four of them?

1500/1600 have 2 plugs per cylinder, so like the 550, each coil can handle 2 cylinders.


Either that or $130 for a pair of Dynas.

[Mike900]

Ahhh - now I understand. Thanks

[nelson8708]

Originally Posted by RichLockyer

Just looked at the right coil on my 1600 (can't get to the left without pulling the bike out of the garage, 1500 and 1600 are nearly identical) and the green terminal is the lead to the ignitor, the black terminal is +12v.

I saw you post in my other thread but, now i'm a bit confused. For a tach signal you you T into the ground off the coil that goes to the ignitor.....right?

If he T'ed into the ground/ignitor side then that means the black is ground and green is 12v......i think

[RichLockyer]

4 contacts on the coil... black, green, and the two high tension leads.
+12v goes to the black, the ignitor (ground or tach) goes to green.
The ignitor provides the ground.

The coil mounting tabs themselves are isolated from the circuitry.


Edit: Okay, I just looked at the 550 wiring diagram and it's a little different on the ignitor side from the EFI systems.
On the 550, when you hit the start button, 12v is fed directly to the coil. Normally, the coil power comes through the ignitor which reduces it to 6-8v (same as the ignition resistor on older cages). For cold starts, the extra voltage aids in starting, but the coil operates on a lower voltage/current to extend life.

So the line in your 550 diagram marked "R/Y" is the positive and goes to the black terminal of both coils. "B" and "Og" (?) go to the green terminals on the coils. That's your pulse signal.

[RichLockyer]

Originally Posted by nelson8708

I saw you post in my other thread but, now i'm a bit confused. For a tach signal you you T into the ground off the coil that goes to the ignitor.....right?

If he T'ed into the ground/ignitor side then that means the black is ground and green is 12v......i think

On that photo, that's a 900, which is a little different from the 1500/1600 (single fire). IF that is a tach lead, it may not be connected correctly. It could also be power for the tach... I'm using my coil's black terminal to provide power for both the tach and the light.
Whether that's for tach power or signal, it's not going to work properly because the 900 needs a single fire adapter

[nelson8708]

Originally Posted by RichLockyer

For cold starts, the extra voltage aids in starting, but the coil operates on a lower voltage/current to extend life.

Being that these coils came off a newer bike (1998 Kawasaki VN1500 Vulcan Classic) do you think they will be fine to take 12+ volts all the time. What ever voltage is at the battery when the bike is running is what the coils will see. Do you think i need to run a inline resistor to drop the voltage?

[RichLockyer]

If you are using the ignitors from the 550, go ahead and try it with that. I don't know how the coils will respond to the reduced voltage, so keep an eye (butt?) out for poor performance at higher RPM... also maybe pull one plug and securely ground it, then start it up and see how the spark looks. If it's a good, blue spark, then the coil is doing fine on the reduced voltage. If it's yellow, then it's wanting more.

You might be better off upgrading the ignitors. A lot of guys with Honda CB's are upgrading to a pair of standard GM ignitors and using GM's HEI coils... the Vulcan coils should do just fine with those ignitors, as they were designed for a CDI type system. The GM ignitors work fine with the stock Honda inductive pickups, so they should also work fine with the KZ pickups.

I'll see if I can find a wiring diagram for those ignitors....

[RichLockyer]

Here ya go...

These use the full 12v 24/7. An advantage to these is that they will accept coils down to 2ohms, so in the future, you could upgrade to the hotter Dynatek "Grey" 2.2ohm coils.
The factory spec for the Vulcan coils is anywhere from 1.9 to 2.9 ohms.

[nelson8708]

if the coils are design to get 12v on the vulcan then i'll just do the same. Their power source will be the ign switch. If i am running a wire from my ign to the coils do i need to run the r/y wire on the ignitor to a 12v source or just cap it off. I cant tell if power needs to go into the ignitor on that wire if that thats the 8v wire your talking about that would normally power the coils. I dont want to hook that up to a 12v source and fry the ignitor by feeding it power where it doesnt want it.

Thanks for all your help rich

-Nelson

[RichLockyer]

Ya, R/Y is power from the ignitors to the coils... the 12v is momentarily fed to the coil side from the start button during cranking only. The Y/B wire is the 12v feed to the ignitors.

Reason I suggest the HEI ignitors is the 550 ignitors may not be able to handle constant 12v from the coils, particularly if the 1500 coils are lower impedance than the stock 550 coils. We know the HEI ignitors will work with 2ohm coils fed by 12v.... plus the HEI ignitors are more rugged than the vintage KZ ignitors.

You can try the stock ignitors, but keep a finger on them and make sure they aren't running hot.