2510 Diesel Mule More Speed
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Has anyone got their 2510 deisel to go very fast. Mine will only go 8-12 mph in the dirt about 23mph on hard surface and that is after you go a mile down a little hill. I am very disopionted in this 2510.
Buy a Rhino. With mods it'll go closer to 65mph.
Ditto on the Rhino. You bought a work only machine, not a work and play machine.Buy a Rhino. With mods it'll go closer to 65mph.
The short answer is absolutely yes! You can safely get the diesel to run at about 42-47 mph in high range.
The means to accomplish this is a bit more complicated due to the nature of the diesel and the fuel injection system Kawasaki uses.
Before you do anything else take your time and break the engine in so it is developing full compression and power. This process will take about 70 hours of 80% low range throttle and a pretty good load with a good quality oil such as what Kawasaki sells. Until that is done the engine will be a total dog and no matter what you do you will only be developing about 40% of its available power. The good news is that the engine will now last about 5,000 hours once broken in properly.
Here are some pointers:
Before you tinker with the throttle valve, get a pyrometer and install it so it reads the exhaust temperature of the gas in the exhaust manifold at the end of the #3 cylinder run. This is critical, as it is real easy to burn a piston and trash the engine. You will always want the exhaust temperature to be no higher than 1,250 degrees F at full load and full throttle. Above that the pistons start spitting out the valves as melted aluminum. A good pyrometer can be obtained from vendors such as Isspro. Get a mechanical version that requires you tap the manifold with a threaded hole, do not use a cheap snowmobile pyrometer that just relies on a drilled hole and a wire probe, they are toys and unsuitable for this application - you have a real diesel and need real instruments!
Pick up a tachometer, if your unit is not already equipped. Then take the rig out and run it as fast as it will go in low range. That is your absolute engine revolution limit, and never exceed it or you will toss a rod through the block. Not good!
Now, take a look at the top of the fuel injection pump. There is a lever that connects to the linkage that connects to the assembly that eventually connects to the throttle.
What you will be doing is bypassing the official Kawasaki "monkey motion" throttle linkage and connecting directly to the throttle valve lever on the injection pump.
How you do that is up to you. I used a marine cable and connected directly to the foot feed.
Once that is done you will be able to run the engine to the RPM redline in any range, that you established earlier with the benchmark run in low range. While doing so watch that Pyrometer and make sure you are not running the EGT above 1,250 degrees F.
For long life of the little diesel you will want to run it at or below approximately an 80% duty cycle, or at about 80% of its maximum rpm with a load most of the time. You can run them at full rpm around 15% of the time and not have any engine damage issues. This allows about 5% of the time for idling.
Oil will be a key item on a diesel that is run hard. I recommend John Deere 15-40 extended life oil once the engine is broken in.
By the way I have a Polaris RZR and a 2510 Mule, and the Mule is by far the better animal and has fantastic fuel economy. The RZR is going by the way as soon as the weather breaks and the suckers start lining up for spring riding.
The means to accomplish this is a bit more complicated due to the nature of the diesel and the fuel injection system Kawasaki uses.
Before you do anything else take your time and break the engine in so it is developing full compression and power. This process will take about 70 hours of 80% low range throttle and a pretty good load with a good quality oil such as what Kawasaki sells. Until that is done the engine will be a total dog and no matter what you do you will only be developing about 40% of its available power. The good news is that the engine will now last about 5,000 hours once broken in properly.
Here are some pointers:
Before you tinker with the throttle valve, get a pyrometer and install it so it reads the exhaust temperature of the gas in the exhaust manifold at the end of the #3 cylinder run. This is critical, as it is real easy to burn a piston and trash the engine. You will always want the exhaust temperature to be no higher than 1,250 degrees F at full load and full throttle. Above that the pistons start spitting out the valves as melted aluminum. A good pyrometer can be obtained from vendors such as Isspro. Get a mechanical version that requires you tap the manifold with a threaded hole, do not use a cheap snowmobile pyrometer that just relies on a drilled hole and a wire probe, they are toys and unsuitable for this application - you have a real diesel and need real instruments!
Pick up a tachometer, if your unit is not already equipped. Then take the rig out and run it as fast as it will go in low range. That is your absolute engine revolution limit, and never exceed it or you will toss a rod through the block. Not good!
Now, take a look at the top of the fuel injection pump. There is a lever that connects to the linkage that connects to the assembly that eventually connects to the throttle.
What you will be doing is bypassing the official Kawasaki "monkey motion" throttle linkage and connecting directly to the throttle valve lever on the injection pump.
How you do that is up to you. I used a marine cable and connected directly to the foot feed.
Once that is done you will be able to run the engine to the RPM redline in any range, that you established earlier with the benchmark run in low range. While doing so watch that Pyrometer and make sure you are not running the EGT above 1,250 degrees F.
For long life of the little diesel you will want to run it at or below approximately an 80% duty cycle, or at about 80% of its maximum rpm with a load most of the time. You can run them at full rpm around 15% of the time and not have any engine damage issues. This allows about 5% of the time for idling.
Oil will be a key item on a diesel that is run hard. I recommend John Deere 15-40 extended life oil once the engine is broken in.
By the way I have a Polaris RZR and a 2510 Mule, and the Mule is by far the better animal and has fantastic fuel economy. The RZR is going by the way as soon as the weather breaks and the suckers start lining up for spring riding.
More speed
Thank you very much for the info. I really like the diesel motor and the mule I just don't like that it is very slow. On the road it will go 27mph on the dirt about 10 to 17 mph depending on how soft it is. Where do I get a pyrometer like that? Thank you again for the info
Thank you very much for the info. I really like the diesel motor and the mule I just don't like that it is very slow. On the road it will go 27mph on the dirt about 10 to 17 mph depending on how soft it is. Where do I get a pyrometer like that? Thank you again for the info
Oops, I lost a paragraph in my answer. My broadband is down because of an ATT wireless network upgrade that is underway, and dial-up is shaky.
After you get the pyrometer installed and the engine rpm baselined, remove the timing cover and the drive gear for the injection pump. There is a Woodruff key (half moon key) that holds the drive to the pump shaft. Replace that with one that is indexed so you advance the pump timing. The indexed keys are available from most specialty gear and sprocket supply houses (usually located in an industrial area and generally go by names such as Industrial Drive and Gear or such), or from diesel power shops that work on Bosch injection pumps. Pick up several different keys, they are inexpensive, and experiment with the advance until you find the best power spot on your engine. You will find that your idle speed increases when the timing is moved up, so be prepared to back it down to keep the drag off the drive belt. The idle adjustment is on top of the pump. Again, keep an eye on the pyrometer so you do not burn down the engine as you find the sweet power range.
The pyrometer will be available from most diesel specialty shops, diesel truck shops, or on-line from many of the guys that specialize in running the power up on diesel cars and pickups. Or, directly from Isspro.com
There is another side benefit from increasing the power and timing, the fuel economy will increase by nearly 30%.
These engines will also handle a turbo, but that requires a bit more pump work and enriching the fueling circuit. Again, any diesel injection shop can turn the pump up for you, or if you are familiar with the Bosch VE series pumps like used on the older VW's and Dodge Cummins diesels, you can follow the same protocol as for those pumps to crank up the fueling rate enough to handle a turbo. I current get a bit more than 72 horses out of mine and am watching my drive system to see how much it will really handle before turning it up any more. If you do a turbo, you have to remember to do a cool down sequence every time you shut it down just like a truck or tractor.
After you get the pyrometer installed and the engine rpm baselined, remove the timing cover and the drive gear for the injection pump. There is a Woodruff key (half moon key) that holds the drive to the pump shaft. Replace that with one that is indexed so you advance the pump timing. The indexed keys are available from most specialty gear and sprocket supply houses (usually located in an industrial area and generally go by names such as Industrial Drive and Gear or such), or from diesel power shops that work on Bosch injection pumps. Pick up several different keys, they are inexpensive, and experiment with the advance until you find the best power spot on your engine. You will find that your idle speed increases when the timing is moved up, so be prepared to back it down to keep the drag off the drive belt. The idle adjustment is on top of the pump. Again, keep an eye on the pyrometer so you do not burn down the engine as you find the sweet power range.
The pyrometer will be available from most diesel specialty shops, diesel truck shops, or on-line from many of the guys that specialize in running the power up on diesel cars and pickups. Or, directly from Isspro.com
There is another side benefit from increasing the power and timing, the fuel economy will increase by nearly 30%.
These engines will also handle a turbo, but that requires a bit more pump work and enriching the fueling circuit. Again, any diesel injection shop can turn the pump up for you, or if you are familiar with the Bosch VE series pumps like used on the older VW's and Dodge Cummins diesels, you can follow the same protocol as for those pumps to crank up the fueling rate enough to handle a turbo. I current get a bit more than 72 horses out of mine and am watching my drive system to see how much it will really handle before turning it up any more. If you do a turbo, you have to remember to do a cool down sequence every time you shut it down just like a truck or tractor.
RCW ... Thanks for posting the info on pepping the diesel Mule up.
I had been watching the RZR, but have seen lots of negative pop up, mostly concerning air-box issues. What problems have you had with yours?
I had been watching the RZR, but have seen lots of negative pop up, mostly concerning air-box issues. What problems have you had with yours?
Thanks for posting RCW, that was great. I'm glad there is a fix for slow moving Mules. I'm going to pass this on to service tech at the local Kawi shop.
Lobocop, the biggest issue with me and the RZR is the engine. As you are probably well aware Polaris uses a Fuji engine. They used to be great engines. Fuji was recently purchased by Makita who promptly transferred manufacturing to China to increase profits. It is warrantied, but if I wanted third rate Chinese products I would have bought a real Chinese chunk of junk in the first place for less than $4,000.
The second biggest issue is the same as with the Rhino, the rear does not have a differential. Both rear tires drive all the time and on slick muddy or icy trails that pushes you out on corners, so makes hunting trips next to impossible except in places you can also drive a Jeep. It also tears the heck out of fields if you use them on the farm or for duck hunting. I want absolutely no tearing of the ground or vegetation where I go, so a vehicle that is easy on the tracks is real important to me. Also, if you run them fast they jump from side to side and jerk you around as one wheel hooks then the other.
The third issue is fuel economy. There is just no reason to get 12-15 MPG this day in age. My old Rhino at least got 14-18.
The fourth issue is seating. The RZR uses an el-cheapo lawn tractor seat system similar to the Rhino. That means it is a real pain to use them when you are decked out in cold weather gear and toting a shotgun, and then they have no usable front storage for that thermos of critical Starbucks and the bottle of Jack either!
The second biggest issue is the same as with the Rhino, the rear does not have a differential. Both rear tires drive all the time and on slick muddy or icy trails that pushes you out on corners, so makes hunting trips next to impossible except in places you can also drive a Jeep. It also tears the heck out of fields if you use them on the farm or for duck hunting. I want absolutely no tearing of the ground or vegetation where I go, so a vehicle that is easy on the tracks is real important to me. Also, if you run them fast they jump from side to side and jerk you around as one wheel hooks then the other.
The third issue is fuel economy. There is just no reason to get 12-15 MPG this day in age. My old Rhino at least got 14-18.
The fourth issue is seating. The RZR uses an el-cheapo lawn tractor seat system similar to the Rhino. That means it is a real pain to use them when you are decked out in cold weather gear and toting a shotgun, and then they have no usable front storage for that thermos of critical Starbucks and the bottle of Jack either!
RCW, thanks for posting that info. Most of the stuff I have heard lately is the engines getting dusted and going into self destruct mode from a poor intake system. Now I will wait for the Teryx to come out and see how it stacks up.
Joined
·
1,086 Posts
Rcw
not being familiar with this engine or pump.
Is there is no way to externally adjust spill timing ?
or is it that you cannot get enough timing out of it that way.
not being familiar with this engine or pump.
Is there is no way to externally adjust spill timing ?
or is it that you cannot get enough timing out of it that way.
Honestlyinsane, some of the engines have lengthened attachment holes on the engine plate, similar to how Dodge mounted the VE on the early Cummins. Others do not. Seems to be luck of the draw, as I have seen them both ways in the same model year.
The difficulty with twisting the pump on those with the elongated holes is that you bind the injection lines, and because these little guys spin up pretty good it creates vibrational stresses that can crack them. 99% of the people out there do not know how to properly re-bend the injection lines to eliminate stress, so I just do not recommend doing that.
There is a feed valve internal to the pump that can be used to turn up the fueling rate. Without proper timing to burn the fuel, tweaking the fueling rate just makes smoke, excessive EGT, and dirty oil. The same is pretty much true for installing larger orifices in the injectors, you create lots of smoke and heat and little power. Timing is the real key to getting these little diesels to perform and perform they will!
I routinely blow the regular Polaris Ranger 800 gas rigs in the weeds, and burn less than half the fuel doing so.
There is another trick, and that is to add a small bottle of Stihl, Husqvarna, or Echo 2 cycle oil to each tank of diesel. That increases the BTU of the fuel by increasing the viscosity, and it solves the problem of premature delivery valve wear in the injection pump that is caused by our latest eco-freak ultra-low sulfur fuels. But, once again timing has to put the injection event farther into the compression cycle or you just blow out the extra energy as smoke and heat and create excessive cylinder carbon that ends up in the oil.
Mine does not smoke as much as it did when it was OEM, which is fine by me as I do not want to smell it as I work my way out through the woods.
The difficulty with twisting the pump on those with the elongated holes is that you bind the injection lines, and because these little guys spin up pretty good it creates vibrational stresses that can crack them. 99% of the people out there do not know how to properly re-bend the injection lines to eliminate stress, so I just do not recommend doing that.
There is a feed valve internal to the pump that can be used to turn up the fueling rate. Without proper timing to burn the fuel, tweaking the fueling rate just makes smoke, excessive EGT, and dirty oil. The same is pretty much true for installing larger orifices in the injectors, you create lots of smoke and heat and little power. Timing is the real key to getting these little diesels to perform and perform they will!
I routinely blow the regular Polaris Ranger 800 gas rigs in the weeds, and burn less than half the fuel doing so.
There is another trick, and that is to add a small bottle of Stihl, Husqvarna, or Echo 2 cycle oil to each tank of diesel. That increases the BTU of the fuel by increasing the viscosity, and it solves the problem of premature delivery valve wear in the injection pump that is caused by our latest eco-freak ultra-low sulfur fuels. But, once again timing has to put the injection event farther into the compression cycle or you just blow out the extra energy as smoke and heat and create excessive cylinder carbon that ends up in the oil.
Mine does not smoke as much as it did when it was OEM, which is fine by me as I do not want to smell it as I work my way out through the woods.
Joined
·
1,086 Posts
Yeah from what you described it sounded similiar to the injection pump on a mitsubishi fuso. I worked on them for many years and we would just turn the pump then again I don't think we were trying to get the timing that you are so moving it 2 to 3 degrees never really hurt the lines.
Should probably put a disclaimer on this thread that anyone that does this will void any warranty they have. Relating to the engine or fuel system.
Should probably put a disclaimer on this thread that anyone that does this will void any warranty they have. Relating to the engine or fuel system.
woodruff key
RCW I was talking to a friend about putting the pyrometer and tach on and was explaneing about the woodruff key. He thought I should ask you what size key and how money degrees did you move yours? That would give me a starting point and it maybe all these little engine are different. Is your tach a isspro and what are you going off of to read your rpm? Should I get a shop manuel for the engine? Is it pretty self explanatary about taking the timing plate off and changing the woodruff key? Is it very hard to do? Does this make the mule quiker like the gas models? You can really go faster than a polaris? Thank for the info
RCW I was talking to a friend about putting the pyrometer and tach on and was explaneing about the woodruff key. He thought I should ask you what size key and how money degrees did you move yours? That would give me a starting point and it maybe all these little engine are different. Is your tach a isspro and what are you going off of to read your rpm? Should I get a shop manuel for the engine? Is it pretty self explanatary about taking the timing plate off and changing the woodruff key? Is it very hard to do? Does this make the mule quiker like the gas models? You can really go faster than a polaris? Thank for the info
I use the OEM Kawasaki hour meter and tachometer that came with the Mule. Seems like it was a $20 option. If I remember correctly the tach reads the pulses from the alternator. I do not remember the size of the Woodruff key, but it is metric and you will find it in the shop manual in the injection pump assembly section. I would definitely get the shop manual, as you will be lost without it.
I initially advanced my timing two degrees before I installed the turbo, now it is 9 degrees advanced and the fueling rate is turned up considerably.
It is pretty easy to beat the gas Mules with very minor tweaks and a good break-in of the diesel, as that lawnmower engine will not stand up to removing the governor and running them at higher rpm's. It will take the turbo to beat the regular 800 cc Polaris Rangers, but you will not be embarrassed with just the timing change either.
As pointed out by Honestlyinsane, the warranty goes out the window! Also be sure your front tie rod ends are in top condition before going over 30 mph, that is something for which I keep a close watch on with mine. Seems there was a recall on the tie rod ends, too.
I initially advanced my timing two degrees before I installed the turbo, now it is 9 degrees advanced and the fueling rate is turned up considerably.
It is pretty easy to beat the gas Mules with very minor tweaks and a good break-in of the diesel, as that lawnmower engine will not stand up to removing the governor and running them at higher rpm's. It will take the turbo to beat the regular 800 cc Polaris Rangers, but you will not be embarrassed with just the timing change either.
As pointed out by Honestlyinsane, the warranty goes out the window! Also be sure your front tie rod ends are in top condition before going over 30 mph, that is something for which I keep a close watch on with mine. Seems there was a recall on the tie rod ends, too.
Wow
Wow that must be something to have a turbo on your mule. Where did you get your turbo at? Was it very hard to put on? I am getting a shop manuel and tach ordered today and hopefully get the pryometer at the deisal shop. Thank you again for the info you must know what you are doing
Wow that must be something to have a turbo on your mule. Where did you get your turbo at? Was it very hard to put on? I am getting a shop manuel and tach ordered today and hopefully get the pryometer at the deisal shop. Thank you again for the info you must know what you are doing
I picked up my turbo from a snowmobile performance shop, it was originally designed for the 660 four stroke gas engine used in one of Arctic Cat's snowmobiles. I built my own exhaust manifold and then had to crank up the injection pump to generate adequate pressure to spin the turbo faster.
Honeywell is designing turbos in India for small European diesels, and they should be available shortly. Other options are the kits for the small Yanmar three cylinder tractor engines.
Honeywell is designing turbos in India for small European diesels, and they should be available shortly. Other options are the kits for the small Yanmar three cylinder tractor engines.
Garrett markets a GT-12 turbocharger that is sized for this range of use. Garrett is owned by Honeywell, and Honeywell is trying to penetrate the European small diesel market and will be bringing new turbos to the market at much more affordable prices.
RCW
That is something. How in the world did you come up with that? I tried to get a tach from kaw dealer and they said it is not avaliable for the deisel. I would love to see your machine that has to be something.
That is something. How in the world did you come up with that? I tried to get a tach from kaw dealer and they said it is not avaliable for the deisel. I would love to see your machine that has to be something.
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
- This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Join the discussion
Kawasaki Motorcycle Forums
A forum community dedicated to Kawasaki Motorcycle owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about performance, modifications, troubleshooting, maintenance, off-road, touring, street bikes, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Recommended Communities
Join now to ask and comment!