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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everybody :) , I finally got arround to taking the head cover off of my '81 KZ1100 shafty. I checked the valve clearance all the way around, half were below .04 mm. I had ordered the Motion Pro shim tool (since Z1 was out of the real tool) so I decided to go for the easiest first: #4 intake. The tool was very difficult to use, I had a hard time getting the springs to compress. This tool is not well designed IMHO. Anyway, I wasn't very successful. I got the shim to pop up and almost out and the tool slipped off the bucket so I decided this was a waste of time :icon_frow . Anyway, I checked the valve lash again and it is now .40! I do not know what could explain that, I think I took a good measurement the first time but this lifter was noticebly noisier than the others to begin with. Anyone have ideas or suggestions? Thanks in advance!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I see a few possibilities: Something is keeping the valve from closing (a piece of dirt on the valve seat?), maybe there was something under the shim, Maybe I made a mistake on my first measurement (It was running fine but that lifter WAS noisy), something happened that I don't get, like the valve bent or something scary like that. I'm just asking to see if someone has seen this before. I'm getting the real tool so I have a few days to think about it. Hope I don't have to take off the head..:confused:
 

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GHOSTRIDER
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I had bad luck using the pry-bar tool too, It broke! Sounds like a piece of carbon (hopefully) may have got caught in the seat. Rotate the engine by hand first, then with the starter to free up whatever may be holding the valve open. Are you sure no debris was dropped into the bucket opening? Ive seen the Kaw tool on ebay along with auxiliary fuel tanks and float bowl level reading tubes at very reasonable prices :wink: The more crap you get out of the way like the coils, the easier it is to access each bucket. Good Luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I had bad luck using the pry-bar tool too, It broke! Sounds like a piece of carbon (hopefully) may have got caught in the seat. Rotate the engine by hand first, then with the starter to free up whatever may be holding the valve open. Are you sure no debris was dropped into the bucket opening? Ive seen the Kaw tool on ebay along with auxiliary fuel tanks and float bowl level reading tubes at very reasonable prices :wink: The more crap you get out of the way like the coils, the easier it is to access each bucket. Good Luck
Coils are out of the way, as is the vacuum smog system, gone! I have rotated by hand quite a bit. My guess was that something got between the valve and the seat so I actually blew air while the valve was open. Maybe I will try using the starter, can't think of anything that could hurt? right? :wink:
Are you sure no debris was dropped into the bucket opening? I don't think anythink would fit, it is so tight...plus the bucket rotates easily. Also when the cam is open, I can easily pick up the bucket/or shim. Hmm, just worried about something I've not thought abought. I'll try using the starter next...:|
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
is the shim completely seated in the bucket ?
Seems to be, I looked at it closely to see if it was cocked but I don't think so.That was one thing I was worried about if someone in the past had put something under the shim? I don't think so because this bike appears to have been very well maintained. It's been sitting in someone's garage for almost 30 years and looks good. Everything is original or best upgrade. I have a feeling that the PO probably idled it too much (but then again, he loved it!) I don't really want to take the head off but what the hay, what's the easiest way to do it? Remember, it was running great (but the valves definitely needed to be adjusted).
 

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KLR`s and BBQ`s
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I recently used the motion pro tool for the first time on my J bike and initially agreed with you on its poor design. After a little practice I got the hang of it and have grown to like it. The # 1 and 4 valves are the hardest to do because the batwing portion of the tool seems to like to sit ontop of the shim itself preventing you from being able to remove it, but I found if you wedge the bottom of the batwing right up against the side it will sit ontop of the edge of the bucket enabling shim removal. Did you use the correct end of the batwing? one side is taller and used for different bikes, maybe you over compressed the valve springs and the bucket is now stuck in a rut in the bucket bore...? Good luck!

Does it look like the shim bucket is coming out all the way? Could you maybe have loosened some of the cam cap bolts enabling the cam to lift off the valves?
 

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GHOSTRIDER
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Before you pull the head,......Slap her back together and run the engine to try and burn and push the carbon/debris through the seat. Is it possible that you over compressed the bucket pushing the valve into the top of the piston causing the split keepers to disengage and relock the retainer a fraction higher/lower than before? I use a strong telescoping magnet and a large set of tweezers to handle the shim removal and installation. Remove the shim and inspect the retainer and the keepers to verify that they are seated correctly. If you think about it,(as I know you have) something changed when you compressed that bucket the first time. If the unused side of the motion pro tool inhibits its use, grind it off leaving only the usable side of the tool. Has the clearance changed since the .40mm reading?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Before you pull the head,......Slap her back together and run the engine to try and burn and push the carbon/debris through the seat. Is it possible that you over compressed the bucket pushing the valve into the top of the piston causing the split keepers to disengage and relock the retainer a fraction higher/lower than before? I use a strong telescoping magnet and a large set of tweezers to handle the shim removal and installation. Remove the shim and inspect the retainer and the keepers to verify that they are seated correctly. If you think about it,(as I know you have) something changed when you compressed that bucket the first time. If the unused side of the motion pro tool inhibits its use, grind it off leaving only the usable side of the tool. Has the clearance changed since the .40mm reading?
Is there any danger in starting the engine? I don't know how I could have overcompressed the valve but it is possible I guess. I used only the small side of the tool. The clearance doesn't seem to stay the same, this AM it is over .5mm!
 

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GHOSTRIDER
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Is there any danger in starting the engine? I don't know how I could have overcompressed the valve but it is possible I guess. I used only the small side of the tool. The clearance doesn't seem to stay the same, this AM it is over .5mm!
Thats Weired! Theres got to be something in the seat. Maybe pull the carbs, turn the cam lobe down on that bucket and blow compressed air through the intake to attempt blowing whatever may be in the seat on into the cylinder. Are the other valves holding their readings, only #4 intake hanging open? It could easily be a chunk of carbon debris .45mm thick laying smashed in the seat that would very well burn and pass through the cylinder once the engine is ran up to temp with some red line blips on the throttle. Then take a compression test again. If that dont work, then its head removal time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Well, I got the head off today (not too bad, kinda fun) I can't tell without taking the valve out if it is bent or just a bunch of crud on the valve seat. I have attached pictures of all four cylinders. The #4 intake is the problem one, it looks dirtier than the others but also I squirted Seafoam in trying to cleanj it out (there was still ZERO compression) Anyway, I think I'll take itr to a shop and have it looked at. I just wonder how much I should do at this point. It has 15K miles and is generally in good condition. The cylinder walls look great as well. Thanks.
 
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