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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #1
Ok so I've decided to take a look at my plugs after a couple of times the bike stalling on me. Usually this happens the first time I start my bike on that day. If I give it gas, it'll seize and stall. I usually have to wait a min or so to start riding it or, once the rpms fall, the bike will stall. On a couple of occasions I'll be riding hard and then let off the gas; the rpms will fall, but below the idle range and the bike will stall at whatever speed I'll be at (100+). Take a look at my plugs for me. I'm having a hard time identifying the problem(if there is one) using this: Spark Plugs.

Ok for those who don't know what I ride...these came out of my FI ZX6R. So unless you know how to lower the amount of gas going into an FI bike, please please stop saying carbs...

Are these plugs fouled out? If so, too hot, too rich, too cold or too lean? If not, is there a way to clean the plugs since I have them out?


*note, bike has slip-on and high flow rate air filter. No Pc3 yet. 10,000km put on these plugs. Half a can of seafoam was used the day before I pulled them out.

Flash


No flash
 

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Vintage bike addict
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It would help to see a new plug of the same brand and size. However I'll give you my best guess. it appears to me that your bike is running rich and someone has compensated with hotter plugs. Look at the center electrode. It's diameter is unusually small. This suggests The edges were burnt off. The blackening suggests a slightly rich fuel mixture. Instead of cleaning the plugs. I'd suggest a new set that is maybe one step cooler and look at the carb adjustment. That is my opinion and others might be more familiar with that particular type plug.
 

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nu2kawi
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Looks like its running rich. How clean is your airfilter? Check your carb settings. Maybe hotter plug. Also sounds like it's flooding causing it to stall when you're giving it gas. Have you done any work on it recently? Something that may have effected the timing, or carb settings?
 

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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #4
It would help to see a new plug of the same brand and size. However I'll give you my best guess. it appears to me that your bike is running rich and someone has compensated with hotter plugs. Look at the center electrode. It's diameter is unusually small. This suggests The edges were burnt off. The blackening suggests a slightly rich fuel mixture. Instead of cleaning the plugs. I'd suggest a new set that is maybe one step cooler and look at the carb adjustment. That is my opinion and others might be more familiar with that particular type plug.
These are the ngk cr9eix. The reason why it's small is becuase these are iridium plugs, not the standard oem plugs. My zx6r recommends cr9e. The bike is fuel injected so no carb...

Also, these plugs run for $12 each...the reason why I put these in was that I would never have to pull them out ever again! When your plugs are underneth the tank, air/fuel mix box, stick coils that jam against your frame I don't really ever want to pull them out again...
The one of the left is a brand new cr9eix
 

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I've heard lots of stories about iridium plugs being a nightmare in small engines. I dunno if any of them are true though. You only need to replace stock plugs every 40-50k, regardless of what anyone else tells you. It just tends to get thrown into most people's annual maintenance. The only reason I've replaced them is because I didn't know how my bikes had been cared for before me.

They look like they're rich. Sometimes if the plugs are fouling up at idle, choke or throttle will get enough gas on the plugs to "wash" off the fouling. I'd try a stock set (CanTire probably has them for 6-8 bucks a set) and see where that leads you. You'll have to ride around on them for a little while to get an idea.
 

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I agree with JimmyD. I've also heard a lot of stories about platinum, or any high priced spark plugs giving people trouble. Both on cars and on motorcycles. I would put in the cheapy's. If nothing else, Just another thing you can cross off the list of what might be causing you problem. The black sooty insulation (white ring inside the end) makes me say you're running rich. If cheapy spark plugs dont work, try two things.

-screw in your pilot jets a half turn each
(you can make a nice tool out of a coat hanger by cutting a 90 degree angle, then smashing down the end to work like a flat screwdriver) [looks like an L]

or

-clean your air filter/replace with K&N.


either lower amount of gas, or increase amount of air going into carbs.

Good luck, let us know what you find.
 

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my bike runs a little rich, plus a lot of boost..... if i use the OEM plugs, it kills them in about 1 week. I replaced my BR9ES plugs with BR9EIX Iridium plugs.... been going a week so far and runs great!! they tell me that i can expect to get about 100,000 kilometres out of them. I paid something like $24 each for them! so they bloody well better be good!! :lol:
 

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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #8
-screw in your pilot jets a half turn each
(you can make a nice tool out of a coat hanger by cutting a 90 degree angle, then smashing down the end to work like a flat screwdriver) [looks like an L]
or
-clean your air filter/replace with K&N.
either lower amount of gas, or increase amount of air going into carbs.
Bike is FI...no carburetors...adjusting is cannot be done to a computer unless I buy a pc3

If you read a little before the pics, I mention the bike has a high flow air filter (ie k&n)
 

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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #9
I've heard lots of stories about iridium plugs being a nightmare in small engines. I dunno if any of them are true though. You only need to replace stock plugs every 40-50k, regardless of what anyone else tells you. It just tends to get thrown into most people's annual maintenance. The only reason I've replaced them is because I didn't know how my bikes had been cared for before me.

They look like they're rich. Sometimes if the plugs are fouling up at idle, choke or throttle will get enough gas on the plugs to "wash" off the fouling. I'd try a stock set (CanTire probably has them for 6-8 bucks a set) and see where that leads you. You'll have to ride around on them for a little while to get an idea.
Yeah me too. I heard a lot of good things in the beginning, but as the bike start to **** out on me, I read again and found the bad...

Yeah I thought they looked rich too. Weird though since the bike has a slip-on and a k&n filter...I thought it would be lean.

You think the seafoam might be one of the reasons why the spark plugs are black? It idled better after I put half the can in. But, riding around right now isn't an option...you should know, we're from the same country haha.
 

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alec, you may have buy a pc3 to fix this. I know they cost a lot. Darrell had this happen on a carbed bike also when he added a K and N filter. Try the cheaper plugs for right now, but I'm sure you've come to this conclusion by now. You have my sympathy on getting to your plugs, I know they are a PITA!

If you have a mechanic you trust in your area, give them a call a see what they say.
 

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I think you put way too much Seafoam in there. I don't remember the recommendations for it, but half a can sounds pretty excessive. Have you gone to a fresh tank of gas and run it on that yet? You also may be so fouled out on those plugs, that you need to replace them. Try tossing the old ones back in and see if it runs any better.
 

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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #12
alec, you may have buy a pc3 to fix this. I know they cost a lot. Darrell had this happen on a carbed bike also when he added a K and N filter. Try the cheaper plugs for right now, but I'm sure you've come to this conclusion by now. You have my sympathy on getting to your plugs, I know they are a PITA!

If you have a mechanic you trust in your area, give them a call a see what they say.
Dang! I knew it...I'll try the stockers again Tina, but I'm thinking I'll need the pc3 to fix this problem.

Thanks for everyone's inputs...my fault for wasting $50:icon_frow

I think you put way too much Seafoam in there. I don't remember the recommendations for it, but half a can sounds pretty excessive. Have you gone to a fresh tank of gas and run it on that yet? You also may be so fouled out on those plugs, that you need to replace them. Try tossing the old ones back in and see if it runs any better.
Yeah could have been...thing is that I had the engine seizing stuff before I did the seafoam...I just pulled them out of the bike after I did the winterizing stuff. It seems to be the spark plug problem. I never had a problem with the stockers seizing my engine. Then again I didn't have the slip-on, only the filter.
 

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Navy Vet Search & Rescue
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Yeah I thought they looked rich too. Weird though since the bike has a slip-on and a k&n filter...I thought it would be lean.

You think the seafoam might be one of the reasons why the spark plugs are black? It idled better after I put half the can in. But, riding around right now isn't an option...you should know, we're from the same country haha.
I'd say definately running rich and you are right that with the mods you did it should be lean if anything. A pc III is the only way I know of that you can adjust your fuel air mix. I've seen dirty/sticking injectors cause similar problems so thats something to think about. A half can is a bit heavy on the seafoam but shouldn't hurt it. At the same time I'd want a fresh tank of gas run thru mine in riding not sitting conditions before I started making major changes based on the way the plugs look.
 

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The Cruising Gunsmith
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I've heard lots of stories about iridium plugs being a nightmare in small engines. I dunno if any of them are true though. You only need to replace stock plugs every 40-50k, regardless of what anyone else tells you.
Well, my Chevy cavalier has the "100,000 mile" spark plugs hidden under a bunch of junk and very hard to get to.... they went 30,000 before they started misfiring. The electrodes were basically gone.

But, the owner's manual says "100,000 miles" for the service interval.

What a load of crap.
 

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The Cruising Gunsmith
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Yeah me too. I heard a lot of good things in the beginning, but as the bike start to **** out on me, I read again and found the bad...

Yeah I thought they looked rich too. Weird though since the bike has a slip-on and a k&n filter...I thought it would be lean.

You think the seafoam might be one of the reasons why the spark plugs are black? It idled better after I put half the can in. But, riding around right now isn't an option...you should know, we're from the same country haha.
If it is one of those new fangled EFI bikes with computer control, it has an O2 sensor in the exhaust stream to adjust the "on time" of the pulses opening the injectors. If that sensor is dirty or dead, it may be running "open loop" (full rich). Changing the pods and filters may have shifted the system enough that the factory set point is not correct.

It does look like it's running really rich.
 

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Lets RIDE!
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Discussion Starter #18
If it is one of those new fangled EFI bikes with computer control, it has an O2 sensor in the exhaust stream to adjust the "on time" of the pulses opening the injectors. If that sensor is dirty or dead, it may be running "open loop" (full rich). Changing the pods and filters may have shifted the system enough that the factory set point is not correct.

It does look like it's running really rich.
Yeah bike is due for a valve adjustment anyways. I'll let them take a look at it. I personally don't want to touch that stuff since it's a new bike and my bro could be out of a bike if I mess up...
 

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Well, my Chevy cavalier has the "100,000 mile" spark plugs hidden under a bunch of junk and very hard to get to.... they went 30,000 before they started misfiring. The electrodes were basically gone.

But, the owner's manual says "100,000 miles" for the service interval.

What a load of crap.
I'd consider using iridium plugs in an auto, it just seems I've come across more horror stories about them in small engines, both fuel injected and carbed. No idea why, maybe more motorcyclists post online (it can be a long winter lol).

I think you put way too much Seafoam in there. I don't remember the recommendations for it, but half a can sounds pretty excessive. Have you gone to a fresh tank of gas and run it on that yet?

You think the seafoam might be one of the reasons why the spark plugs are black? It idled better after I put half the can in. But, riding around right now isn't an option...you should know, we're from the same country haha.
Nah, I wouldn't worry about the seafoam. I dumped a whole bloody can into the tank on the EX when I bought it and it cleared it up enough that I could ride it home (It was barely ridable before that). I did the same with the vulcan last spring. To be honest I didn't even notice it smoking with a can mixed into a full 4-5 gallon tank.

Dunno if it's actually doing the bike any more good than running the correct amount ( I doubt it ) but it wasn't enough to foul my plugs. Mine uses DR9EAs which are also a 9, but I don't know if the "hotness" is uniform between different plug types.

But, storm's advice would definitely be worth a try. New stock NGKs and a fresh tank of regular gas (premium can cause plug fouling in some odd cases). And I hear ya, it sure isn't riding weather out there. It's -18C right now in Halifax! :(
 
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